In this interview for the influential independent Chinese website, Martin Jacques dissects the now dominant Western narrative about China. Between around 2000 and 2016, that narrative combined scepticism and hostility with curiosity and openness. The latter have now largely disappeared to be replaced by a Cold War narrative which reduces China to the Chinese Communist Party and more than 2000 years of extraordinary history to the period since 1949. It might be an effective tool of excommunication in the short run but it explains precious little about China. In the long run the West needs to make sense of China not dismiss it. The interview is in English with Chinese sub-titles.